The Interview: Sophia Smith
The 22-year-old Portland and USWNT rising star has big plans. "I want to be the best player in the world."
At 22, Sophia Smith is going places. She’s on fire in the NWSL, where the Portland Thorns winger has 11 goals on the season, tied for the league lead. And she has become an impact starter for the USWNT, helping lead the U.S. to the recent CONCACAF title. We recently got our first chance to have a sit-down interview together, which I really enjoyed below.
The entirety of the written interview below is reserved for paid subscribers. As always, you can still get the entire free audio version of my podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you like to go for your pods.
Grant Wahl:
Our guest now is the MVP favorite this season in the NWSL and one of the electric young attackers on the U.S. women's national team. Sophia Smith has 11 goals for the first-place Portland Thorns and recently helped lead the United States to the CONCACAF championship. Sophia, congratulations on everything you're doing and thanks for coming on the show.
Sophia Smith:
Thank you. Thanks for having me. I'm excited.
Grant Wahl:
So we're going to talk Portland. We're going to talk the national team, but first I want to ask you about something that you posted on Twitter a few years ago. It was a cool photograph of young you with Abby Wambach when she was with the U.S. women's national team. What were the circumstances around that photograph?
“I want to be the best player in the world. That’s always been my goal. That’s always been my dream, even when I was little. I know it’s a big goal, but it’s something that I know that I can achieve.” — Sophia Smith
Sophia Smith:
So I had just gotten my first cap with the U.S. women's national team. I just remember she tweeted something about me getting my first cap. And I thought to myself, I was like, "Wait, I have a picture with her when I was little." I remember going and watching her play with the women's national team and her being a huge reason why I started to have the dreams that I had and started to really work toward being on the national team and that being one of my biggest goals. So I had my mom dig around to find the picture, and I tweeted it back at her and just said, "You are a big reason why I am where I am today," just to thank her for being an inspiration.
Grant Wahl:
It was a really cool exchange between the two of you because you had a little back and forth, I remember. Have you had any interactions with Abby Wambach since then?
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Sophia Smith:
No. That's really it.
Grant Wahl:
Okay. Interesting. I guess she's also an owner in the league now with Angel City, so she's a little bit of an opponent now.
Sophia Smith:
Yeah. It's a little bit of a rival, but I'm always following her and her wife. I think they're some of the coolest people, but I'm just grateful that even that interaction happened.
Grant Wahl:
Right now things seem to be going really well with the Thorns. First place in the league. You're scoring a lot of goals. You've got 11 now on the season. Why do you think things are going so well? What's coming together for y'all?
Sophia Smith:
I think it's a lot of things. I think we came into this season, there was a lot of change. We had a new coach, a new ownership, new players, new faces. I think going into this season, realizing that we have to take it game by game and not look too far ahead of ourselves because the NWSL season is a long season. If you get caught trying to look too far ahead or focusing on what hasn't happened yet, I think that's when you kind of start to struggle.
This group has done a really good job of growing every single day, whether it's in training or a game. Just building that chemistry and those relationships on and off the field, I feel like we've put a lot of attention in the details. Just taking each day as it is, and each challenge as it is. Every game is a new opportunity. I think we are just focused on that. I think that's what is helping us and allowing us to be successful as we are just very in the moment.
Grant Wahl:
What in particular about your game individually, especially the goal-scoring part of it, has taken a leap this year? What are you seeing?
Sophia Smith:
I think it's just confidence in the freedom to be myself and to play how I like to play, and the way I feel I'm best playing. I think it fits into this team really well. I think everyone brings their specialty to the game. Our coaching staff and the Thorns as a program allows people to be special and to be themselves, and figuring out a way to be able to do that, as well as helping my team in any way that I can. I think it's just gone really well. I think that's allowed me to be more confident, regardless of my age, regardless of how many years I've had in the league. I feel like I've found my place. And I'm just having fun. I think that's the biggest thing. I'm not stressing out about awards, or any of that stuff, I'm not thinking too much about. I'm honestly just having fun. I think with that comes goals. I love scoring goals. And ultimately our team wins.
Grant Wahl:
I'm glad you're not stressing out about awards or nominations. I am sort of angry on your behalf today though, because the Ballon d’Or nominations came out, and I think there are three Americans and two NWSL players on the nomination list. I would've thought if that were the case that you would be one of them, because you've had a terrific year. I was surprised about this. I don't know if I'd say I was angry, but were you surprised?
Sophia Smith:
No. I'm pretty used to kind of being, I don't know, not talked about. I feel like I have stopped caring about those things because a lot of the time it's not going to be what you want. Ultimately, those awards don't mean a lot to me. I'm happy with where I am. I'm proud of what I've been able to accomplish so far. Obviously I want to do a lot more. If those awards come, great. If they don't, you know, it is what it is. I'd say I'm just used to it at this point.
Grant Wahl:
I know one award I'm sure you're excited about and really pushing for is winning the NWSL title later this season. Obviously, you are on a good track right now, but your league has playoffs. What to you are the most important things that you and your team need to do to put yourselves in a position to keep that momentum going through the playoffs and win that trophy?
Sophia Smith:
I think it's just a matter of continuing what we've been doing. I think it's very easy toward the end of the season for teams to get comfortable, or to stop doing the little details and to be tired, rightfully so. It's a long season. But I think as long as we can continue to take each game as it is and focus on putting everything we have into the game that we have at that moment, that's going to be huge for us. To continue to just believe in ourselves and to trust our teammates around us that we've made it this far. We just have to continue doing that and not think too much about the end result, but know that's what we're going after.
Grant Wahl:
You are from Colorado originally. On this podcast earlier this year, we've had Lindsey Horan, who's also from Colorado originally. We had Mal Pugh, who's also from Colorado originally. And all of you are making big impacts at club level right now and with the national team. I'm sort of fascinated with the idea of soccer hotbeds, and Colorado certainly seems like a talent hotbed, including in the women's game. What is it about the culture there that produces that?
Sophia Smith:
I get asked this question a lot. People ask me what's in the water in Colorado. Honestly, I can speak on my experience playing soccer in Colorado. It's the club that I played for. It's the coaches that I had the honor of being coached by. I learned so much playing for Real Colorado. I had amazing coaches there, the main one being Lorne Donaldson, who I give a lot of credit to helping me get to where I am today and believing in me and seeing the potential in me.
So I think it's the environment. It's the coaches who care about the development of players and who believe in players, even from a young age. I just think having players from Colorado to look up to for young girls right now, for myself, I had Mal to follow on in her footsteps, and Lindsey's a little older than her, so maybe it was Lindsey for her. But I think seeing people do it before you and come from the same place as you definitely helps a lot, and match that with the amazing clubs that there are in Colorado, it's a good place to be a women's soccer player.
Grant Wahl:
I was going to ask you about Lorne Donaldson because he is the Jamaica women's national team coach now. They're going to be at the world cup. He's done a very good job there. Why is he so good at it? What did you learn from him that made him a special coach for you?
Sophia Smith:
For me, I'm someone who learns best from someone putting me in my place and someone telling me how it is, being very honest with me, not sugarcoating anything. And that's Lorne. So I guess if you are someone who doesn't handle that very well, maybe they would've had a different experience, but for me that's what I needed. That's what pushed me to continue to want to get better. I think he's that, but he's also very caring. He's also someone to believe in you more than anyone else, and to want what's best for you. The way that he does that is just unlike any coach I've ever had. He knows soccer really well. He knows the details and he helps you work on those things.
Grant Wahl:
So what's an example of something that he might have said to you as a coach that was giving it to you straight that not every coach would do?
Sophia Smith:
I mean, there were a lot of moments. Obviously, at the time, I thought, "This guy's crazy. I don't like him," but looking back, yeah, I absolutely loved him. I think one of the biggest ones, I don't know if this helped me or not, but it's just an example of him being very honest. We were at a club game. I don't remember where, and I just wasn't having the best game. At halftime, he in front of the whole team, said something about, "Do you think these national team coaches are going to want to bring you into camp when you're playing like this?" Something like that.
I was just embarrassed and wanted to cry, and just like, "How can this guy say that to me in front of everyone?" But he was just... He got on me. I think he knew at the time, maybe I didn't know this, but that's how you piss me off and fire me up. After that, I'm going to go out and prove to him why these national team coaches are going to bring me into camp. So that's just one example, but there's quite a few that we laugh about now.
Grant Wahl:
Thank you for sharing. I was in the stadium in Mexico when you were playing for the U.S. recently and scored this really absurd goal, amazing goal, with the outside of your foot, against Jamaica. What exactly was your thought process in the moment to even try something like that?
Sophia Smith:
I think when I get in my zone, and when I am just playing without really thinking too much about things, I just try things. I feel like I have the confidence within the national team now to play like that, because that's how I know how to play, but I think in that moment I just was figuring out how to get the ball in the back of the net. I remember there was a defender coming on my left side. So if I would've waited for the ball to settle down and hit it with my left foot, it would've gotten blocked.
I saw the little opening on the far side of the goalkeeper. I just thought this is the only way I can get it there, so let me try it. Hopefully it works, and it worked. I hit it pretty good, but yeah, when I feel good, I just try things. I think that's how those things happen.
Grant Wahl:
Are there any other outrageous skill things like that that you've been working on maybe in training, to try and get right?
Sophia Smith:
Not really specifically. In training, when we do small-side and stuff, I'm always trying new things and trying to be a little crafty and creative and figure out ways to, I don't know, put on a show. But I think it mostly just comes to me in games, and I envision it, and then I just do it.
Grant Wahl:
Vlatko Andonovski down in Mexico, the U.S. coach, said at one point, and this was after I think a really good game you had, maybe the Jamaica game, said that you can be hard on yourself at times if you don't score in a game. Is that accurate? Is that changing? What's your sense?
Sophia Smith:
Yeah, that's accurate. I've always considered myself a goal scorer. That's what I feel like I do best. That's what I feel like I can contribute to the teams that I'm on. I think, as I've gotten older and played in different teams, played in the league and with the national team, I’ve realized that a goal doesn't mean a good performance, and a good performance doesn't mean you had a goal. I'm starting to really realize that. Every game is different. There'll be times where it's just not happening for me in terms of putting the ball in the back of the net. So it's how can I help my teammates do that? How can I set up my teammates? Yeah, I think I've just stopped putting so much emphasis on if I score a goal, it's a good game. If I don't, it's a bad game, because in reality, there's so much more happening in a game.
Grant Wahl:
When I was starting out covering soccer, North Carolina had the biggest women's program. They won the NCAA title every year. It seems like more recently Stanford has become the team, one of the couple teams, that seems to win a heck of a lot at the college level. You went to Stanford, played there. I'm curious, what was your experience like playing at Stanford? I did a big story not long ago on Catarina Macario. What was it like playing there with people like that?
Sophia Smith:
It was awesome. I loved everything about Stanford. I think the environment... You have to be someone who wants to win to play on that team. You have to be someone who wants to achieve greatness, because first of all getting into Stanford is not easy, let alone being a student athlete at Stanford. It's hard. I think when you fill a team with those types of people who just want to work hard, want to be great, want to win, you get the results that we've been getting. I think when I was there, we had an unreal team, looking back. Not to sound cocky or anything, but that had to have been one of the best college teams of all time. Looking at the people who were on that team, what we were able to accomplish. I think just being on that team allowed me to grow in so many ways. And I could look around me left and right and learn from the players around me. It was just a really amazing environment to be in.
Grant Wahl:
I saw recently that you signed a new three-year contract with the Thorns. So congratulations on that.
Sophia Smith:
Thank you.
Grant Wahl:
Did you have any interest in a European team, or was it Portland all the way?
Sophia Smith:
I mean, I have always thought about going to Europe and playing overseas. It's always been an option. I think right now in my career playing here, being close to home, Portland is just where I feel like I belong right now. It's where I want to be. I love this city. I love the team. I love the club. And I'm really happy right now. That's not to say that later down the road there will be opportunities in Europe, or abroad or wherever. That's definitely not crossed off my list. It's just right now this is what I feel like is best for me. And we'll see what happens later down the road.
Grant Wahl:
For a number of years when I was covering the U.S. women's national team, it was a pretty white team. I remember covering the '99 women's World Cup. Actually, recently Briana Scurry met up with me here in New York. She had her book come out, wrote about her experience. And she was the only Black starter on that U.S. team. I'm wondering, now that we're finally seeing a lot of Black players on the U.S. women's national team, is that something that you notice? Is that something that's important to you?
Sophia Smith:
Yeah. It's definitely something I notice, because I am one of them. It's not every day that I can look around me and see a lot of players like me. Even growing up, I was always one of few Black players on my club teams. I think it's great. I think representation matters. For a lot of young Black girls, girls of color out there looking at this team and watching this team play, I think it's great for them to see people who look like them, and to know that that can be them too. You still have to realize that the people who are on this team deserve to be on this team for no reason other than how they're performing, and what they can do on the field. If that so happens to be a lot of Black girls, that's great. I think it's time that we get the same recognition that everyone has gotten. I think it's just great to have more diversity in all aspects of life. Especially with this team, it's great for everyone, I think.
Grant Wahl:
Following you on Twitter, I saw that your boyfriend is the Stanford wide receiver Michael Wilson. How do you influence each other as elite athletes?
Sophia Smith:
In so many ways. He is the most hardworking person I know, and I know a lot of athletes. He does everything right. He does everything to set himself up for success. I think that's something that I learned from and have continued to learn from him the past three years, is how can I do the little details to set myself up to be successful. What does that look like? He teaches me that. I learn so much from him. And I think vice versa. I think we're just very supportive of each other and understand the goals and dreams that we have and do everything we can to help each other achieve those and to support each other in whatever way we can. Because being athletes, it is stressful. He's at Stanford, and that's really stressful, trying to balance athletics and academics. Just supporting each other and being there for each other, and continuing to just help each other achieve our dreams and goals that we have.
Grant Wahl:
When I told some friends, younger friends, that I was interviewing you, one, they were excited, and then two, they said you’ve got to ask her about the bubble braid. I'm not usually a hair expert, as you can probably tell.
Sophia Smith:
You aren’t? (laughs)
Grant Wahl:
I'm not always up on trends. Is the bubble braid your thing? How did that start?
Sophia Smith:
I have two older sisters. My mom used to always put us in bubble braids when we were little. I think at the time I didn't think anything of it, but this year, my hair has been a little longer and I've tried to find something new to do. I didn't want to do just the traditional braid. I didn't want to do a bun anymore, so I kind of just one day with the national team did a bubble braid. And I really liked it, and I played really well. So I was like, "Okay, I think this is the season of the bubble braid," and I've just done it ever since. Now people associate me with the bubble braid. I can't change it now because it's already too far out there.
Grant Wahl:
It's funny, because I did a story a couple months ago on the U.S. men's national team actually puts their money together to fly out a barber to national team camps occasionally. This guy is here in New York, actually, is where he is based. I went out to his barber shop, talked to him. Really interesting figure. Do you have someone like that on the U.S. women's team, or do you handle your hair yourselves?
Sophia Smith:
We do not. I want to say most people do their own hair. I think Pinoe obviously has someone that she goes to get her crazy fun colors done, but yeah, as far as like game hair, most people do it themselves unless they need help doing a braid. And we have a few players on the team that will help out with that, but we don't travel with a hair stylist. (laughs)
Grant Wahl:
I'm glad you've cleared up these very important topics. It's interesting though. I love that stuff.
Sophia Smith:
Yeah. It's a good question.
Grant Wahl:
I guess one thing I would ask is, it's August. A year from now is the World Cup. Obviously, there's going to be a lot of things happening at club level between now and then, you'll have big national team games coming up. Let's ask about one of those big national team games against England. I was at the Euro final at Wembley. It was full. It's going to be full again in October when the world champion U.S. plays the European champion England. The game sold out in 24 hours. What's your sense of this game? What's your excitement level?
Sophia Smith:
I'm beyond excited. I think it's going to be a great test for us. This is a top, top team. It's always a rivalry game when we play England. So I think it's just going to be a really good game. To play in Wembley and to have it sold out is like a dream come true for any soccer player. I am beyond excited. I know everyone on the team cannot wait. Obviously, we have to prepare for it and be ready for it because it's not going to be easy, but I think it's going to be great. It's just great for women's soccer in general.
Grant Wahl:
Now I had Heather O'Reilly on the podcast last week. I asked her to handicap the game. I realize it's a friendly, but still, she said she gave a slight advantage to England just because they've come through a harder tournament than the U.S. did in CONCACAF, even though you did beat Canada, the Olympic gold medalist, in the final. Do you disagree with Heather? Or what's your response to anyone who thinks that England has the edge in this game?
Sophia Smith:
I think that opinion is not rare. I think everyone thinks what they want to think. We really do not care. Yeah, we don't care. We will do what we need to do to get a result in this game, and not only this game, but in every tournament we play in, including the World Cup. If people want to doubt us, or not believe in us, that's their own choice, but yeah, we don't care.
Grant Wahl:
I do want to ask you about the year between now and the World Cup for this U.S. team, because Andonovski in Mexico said when he was asked about this topic, he was like, if the World Cup were tomorrow, I wouldn't say that we're totally ready. We will be ready for the World Cup a year from now. From your perspective, what are some of the things that you think will be ready for the World Cup that maybe wouldn't be ready tomorrow?
Sophia Smith:
We have a lot of new faces on this team, a lot who are young and don't have a lot of experience on a big stage playing against big opponents. That's not necessarily a bad thing. I think it's a great new, fresh energy, but at the same time we have to build those relationships. We have to find the chemistry. We can only do that with experience and with time. So having the friendlies that we have coming up and using every single moment we have in camp together I think is so important for us. I know by the time the World Cup comes around, it will just flow, and we will all play so well together. It's just a matter of time before everything starts clicking really well, because the talent that we have and the players that we have that want to win everything, it's unreal. I think it's just trusting that with time, with games, it will be really, really fun. It's just a matter of time before it's all flowing.
Grant Wahl:
I just want to finish it up with one more question. Usually, I ask this when I talk to a young player and it's the first time we’ve sat down for an interview together. What do you want to achieve in your career?
Sophia Smith:
I want to be the best player in the world. That's always been my goal. That's always been my dream, even when I was little. I know it's a big goal, but it's something that I know that I can achieve. I think as long as I continue to be confident and bring what I can to every game, I think I’ll achieve that.
In terms of goals, I want to win everything that I play in. I want to help the Thorns become a great team, even better than they've already been. And the national team, I want to continue the legacy that this U.S. women's national team has had and take it even farther, and just grow each and every day as a player and as a person, and use the experiences that I get to help me in life, even after soccer.
Grant Wahl:
Sophia Smith is the MVP favorite this season in NWSL and one of the electric young attackers on the U.S. women's national team. Sophia, thanks for coming on the show.
Sophia Smith:
Thanks for having me.
if you asked a NT player to respond every time HAO says something idiotic, you might never get your own questions in. stopped listening to her once she went after Ada for stepping away from Norway in demanding equal treatment for their WNT. looking forward to Lavelle cooking Walsh in midfield again as she has done every time they've played eachother.
Excellent interview with an exciting player. I wish you had asked her : “ who is the fastest player on the USWNT?” Because Sofia has great pace, as do a few others ( Mallory, for sure; Alex . Do you know the answer, Grant?